Posts
It should be noted, before I start wandering here, that all the various kinds of swords we have put names to were just called "sword" in their day. Most of the names are from archaeologists attempting to sort out the timeframes of grave goods.
Oakeshott typology is probably the most famous way to sort what GURPS will call a "broadsword" and D&D will call a "longsword."
GURPS has a list of swords that are all "broadswords" under the rules.
The D&D 5e equivalent to "broadsword" is "longsword" and it covers a wide variety of side-arms. Perhaps more because the "versatile" tag means it can be used 2-handed; which would imply bastard sword is included.KhopeshBroadswordLarge FalchionPataShotelBastard Sword (used one handed)DaoEstocHook-SwordJianKatanaLongswordBackswordCavalry SaberEdged Rapier
This is a continuation from 4e where the weapons list is a bit longer, but still much shorter than 2e. I don't have any 3e books (or 3.5e books for that matter).
2e was longer than AD&D.
D&D, starting with 4e makes a distinction between "simple" and "military" weapons. 5e calls the distinctions "simple" and "martial."
With how over-the-top inclusive Wizards of the Coast went, I cannot but wonder if these categories are from the thinking about "assault weapons" among liberals.
The historical divide over some weapons is related to sumptuary laws in that you needed to be of a certain social rank to have them.
Cost wasn't the only reason a peasant didn't have a sword in many places.
But ahistorically egalitarian D&D can't make the common/noble distinction and still have adventurers, so...
I'm amused to note that 2e has a firearm, an arquebus. It also adds the rapier. 4e and 5e don't have guns, but keep a sword that was developed from guns driving armor off the battlefield.
Warhammer FRP is even more consolidated, most everything is a "hand weapon"
Hand Weapon: This broad class includes one-handed axes, swords, clubs, maces and hammers. These weapons are all comparable in use and effect, and no distinction is made between them in the rules.
Yet it still has a rapier...
Pathfinder 2e follows the same pattern as D&D (shocking! I know) but breaks the falchion out from longsword and still has a separate bastard sword.
Rapier without firearms again...
LBB Traveller has guns, so many guns...
Sword is the one handed, all inclusive sword. Broadsword is a two-hander. Cutlass is loosely defined enough to include a rapier.
Top Secret might have rules for swords, it definitely has rules for throwing them...
Top Secret SI has a "sword".
Was one that always drove me a bit nuts... The European "Longsword" being my weapon of choice for swords, but it traditionally (in D&D at least) being called a "Bastard Sword"... But interesting to read your explanations of a lot of the workings of the fantasy systems, thank you!
ReplyDeleteI'd have to go to the basement and pull up my copy of the original Top Secret rules, but I'm pretty sure that "Swordplay" was one of the "hand-to-hand combat" systems that they had a matrix for. It was part of their whole weird system where you picked an attack (or two) and a defense (or two) each round and then applied them to see what the damage category was. Very roshambo.
ReplyDeleteException to signature made here.
DeleteI found the matrices on the GM's screen, but not in the main book. GRRRRR.
But if I missed them, please give me the page numbers.
Sorry for not signing - I'm the responder from above.
ReplyDeleteThe swordplay table is on page 29 on my copy (the old one with the red cover trim). Matrices continue through page 31 for untrained combat, Knife fighting, Boxing, Judo, and "Martial arts".
Rich (cordolf@hotmail.com)
I have Combat Results running from 28-29 in my copy.
DeleteBoxing or Swordplay is on 32! Thanks for helping me find it!
Mine's a scan of the April 1980 second printing. Prolly introduced new errata.
DeleteGlad to be of help!
DeleteLooks like mine is the Feb 1981, "Second Edition" according to the copyright notice.
Cheers!